Your insights are most appreciated, thanks for taking the time to read all of this and comment.

As always you and Kelly are loved and missed.

Andrew

To have someone who knows several of “not/us” is comforting, and I think you have pointed out some of our dynamics like a true insider.

I think you are indeed an architct of deeper and more resonant mythology, and your input is invaluable, especially at this formative time.

reading Andy’s post, the following hit me like a snotklap on a dark night: “…dogma and method suddenly stifled the progress…”

after enjoying the space to move & commune freely, i think i would have found it surreal to then find myself laying on hands, discussing theology etc – i don’t know what precisely was discussed. elaboration anyone?

when one wants to break into something spiritually deeper and more authentic and embarks on an experience like you all did on the weekend, the urge to discuss and analyse immediately after the event can be strong, and often adds considerable value.

the flipside is that it can also take people too rapidly from the right/creative/intuitive brain to the left/linear/analytical. with the greatest value being in the balance between the two, maybe you guys need to agree beforehand how much “discussion” is going to go during or soon after the experience. after all, while you were consciously engaged during the movement session, the real work would have been going on at an unconscious level.

Nic, you find yourself mediating between two paradigms, namely evangelical/modern/exclusive and post-evangelical/post-modern/inclusive – this is entirely consistent with the post-modern inclusive heterodox evangelical alchemist christian that you are and is of tremendous value. amongst other things, i respect your authority.

Andy, you cut to the chase, avoid over-analysis and bullshit and have a palpable desire for Truth. i can’t comment too much on what went on after the movement, when things moved into discussion and prayer, but i suspect i would felt uncomfortable with the transition. as Nic said in his last comment, “confusion and chaos is our current ethos”, so whatever differences arose, you stand on the same bedrock.

where i currently stand in my spiritual walk & understanding, i only want to engage in theological debate & apologetics in order to defend the inclusion and embracing of another. in terms of my own walk, i now seek a deeper & more resonant mythology rather than theology.

in short, i think what you have embarked on together is wonderful and very promising. as you move through the differences, you will glimpse the space/place you seek in communion with each other.

continue being open & bold.

Firstly, most LOVED the class and the concept. Others, however, didn’t get it at all, (for a wide variety or reasons), but were pushed into a place of active questioning.

Secondly, almost all had a very difficult time with the evangelical outburst and subsequent prayer huddle. In fact I was the sole defender of the situation, despite generally being the one that has enabled this whole stretching away from our familiar traditions.

I have found myself playing a mediating role here, not really between people as much as between paradigms. We find ourselves in a blessed liminality.

Most of “us” (remember there is no real “us”) seem quite keen to jettison church wholesale. While I am all for throwing out useless or harmful traditions, and have developed an inclusive view of Christ’s work, I don’t want to merely react.

What happened on Sunday was for me a lancing of toxins; it was a healing moment. The more “evangelical” ones were being stretched but remained open and I give them that credit. The anti-evangelicals were being stretched by confronting the black dog of evangelicalism.

Confusion and chaos is our current ethos. We bear the pain of transformation. If you want stability or a well defined faith, you will not find it here. We are in a river, some abandoned to the central flow and others spinning in the eddys between the current and the sidewaters, now pointing down stream , now upstream, spinning, untethered, anarchic, confused and blissful.

Remember this feeling.

Nic, do not be scared of the “We”. A micro-community is emerging. There can be close community with macro-diversity.

As I said, “we” were not a “we”, we were a loose group of experimenters. To claim that traditional vocal prayer is redundant is to assume there is an established tradition and praxis of non-vocal prayer: there is not.

Another POV is this:
To lay on hands and pray out loud, even (at a pinch) to “preach evangelically” in the middle of a NIA class, is a very fresh thing, all in all. The charismatic reflexes themselves might have been well trod, but the context in which they were uttered was very fresh.

If we had not had the view of things we do, there never would have been a group of 13 Christians smack bang in the middle of a New Age healing environment… that in itself is an acheivement of note.

I’m with you in that. However, I did feel the desire to invite the Spirit to be present, to hear from Her and join her as She worked. I believe we stumbled crudely and messily toward worship and intimacy with each and Goddess.

I’m challenged by the idea of developing our human side to spirituality, increasing the breadth and scope of what it means to be in community of one spirit and to worship intimately and openly.

I’m equally challenged by the notion that Goddess desires to be with us, to be in us, to move around us, to be present through us.

I also feel that the words prayed were redundant in that context and feared that they stemmed from the ingrained evangelical need to preach and convert. However, I’m convinced that we need to co-discover what it means to be envoys effecting the contributions of Christ Jesus in our day and in our lives and in our world.

I’m excited by the growing opportunity between us to reshape what it means and looks like to worship in abandon. I think our ancestor David would’ve been proud; I sense that the Spirit of Christ desires far beyond our own to embrace us in dance, in intimacy, so that we may truly and deeply know Goddess.

Having met with Kathy I’m encouraged by her openness and maturity. She really does follow Christ Jesus as do we.

Andy,

Thanks for getting the ball rolling. You’ve really put yourself on the line. I acknowledge your humility and your honesty and your integrity in doing so.

To everyone,

In a year I believe we’ll all look back and be surprised by how many have been inspired by our pilgrimage together. We have the privilege of discovering something for ourselves that will be a contribution to many. We are led by the Spirit in this. Let’s take heart. Let’s be encouraged. Let’s choose to see the good in all things.